Broken Bat - Help: How bad is the left handed infielder penalty?

Forum >> Help >> How bad is the left handed infielder penalty?

Post ID	Date & Time	Game Date	Function

#31226	02/26/2016 9:50:54 am
BrianV Joined: 02/08/2016 Posts: 125 Inactive	Brad Day seems to be set up to be a good 2B player, except that he's left handed. Is he basically relegated to being an Outfielder because of the penalty, or is it worth trying to convert him to 2B?

#31230	02/26/2016 10:12:02 am
wuggla Joined: 05/10/2013 Posts: 1064 Colorado Springs Vultures V.13	Only player in my team history to win Rookie of the year Award was a left handed SS. Yes they can play good infield with left hands. But i would hope that scouting says Amazing in the field or Outstanding. Plus if you got a manager that is good at managing defence could offset the penalty. i think its very small penalty for them it should only affect his arm or throwing errors. I don't think it has affect on his range or fielding. Could be wrong.

#31232	02/26/2016 10:17:14 am
BrianV Joined: 02/08/2016 Posts: 125 Inactive	Scouting Report: He can develop into a decent slugger. He has decent speed. He can be outstanding in the field. He has good overall potential. If the penalty is small, I may try to convert him then. Is there any posts about how manager ratings work? Mine has 17 years experience, but is 10s across the board. I see under 'New Managers' there are ones with better numbers, but no experience.

#31237	02/26/2016 11:51:46 am
newtman Joined: 11/02/2013 Posts: 3343 Inactive	First, the penalty was only implemented around 2017 iirc, so any lefty guys before that did not suffer the penalty. Second, the penalty is relatively small, at LL V or VI if he is your best option, then go with him. Once you start getting into the super competitive upper leagues though that penalty can make the difference between 3rd place and relegation in a tight race, or 1st and 2nd. Essentially, you'll want to start looking for a replacement as soon as possible, but he can be your short term 2B.

#31238	02/26/2016 11:54:10 am
newtman Joined: 11/02/2013 Posts: 3343 Inactive	About the managers, the new managers were put in two seasons ago. All new managers will have scouting reports which reflect what their skills will be, all old managers will stay straight 10s. There are several extremely useful threads on the new managers I suggest you look at them.

#31245	02/26/2016 1:38:48 pm
Crazy Li Joined: 01/25/2015 Posts: 879 Inactive	I would assume it's not as bad on a 2B since they don't need as much throwing skill as compared to SS or 3B. Still, I would probably pretend he had 3 levels lower arm than actuality if he's left-handed... so a guy with 12 arm would turn out to be more of a 9 playing 2B. If that still sounds like a good 2B to you, I say go with it. If it falls below your standards, look elsewhere. Now his actual effective arm is most likely NOT 9. I just made that up arbitrarily, so don't believe that this is how it works... it's just a rough guide erring on the side of caution, because I can't imagine the penalty is more severe than this. More realistic is something like a -15% penalty in which he would drop by 1.8 to around 10. Updated Friday, February 26 2016 @ 1:40:19 pm PST

#31250	02/26/2016 2:06:28 pm
newtman Joined: 11/02/2013 Posts: 3343 Inactive	Keep in mind there are no throwing errors, so I'm pretty sure the penalty is applied to the fielding stat.

#31251	02/26/2016 2:15:37 pm
Crazy Li Joined: 01/25/2015 Posts: 879 Inactive	Well then take what I said and apply it to fielding then. Unfortunate it works that way since being left-handed has no impact on fielding ability in real life. It's all in the arm.

#31253	02/26/2016 3:38:26 pm
afreespirit Joined: 09/17/2011 Posts: 305 Inactive	For a LH 2B the penalty should also eliminate him from completing double plays. It probably doesn't.

#31256	02/26/2016 4:13:11 pm
pyrog Joined: 07/16/2014 Posts: 41 Inactive	I had a LH 2b for a few seasons and it was terrible the last 2 seasons I had him. John perkens His fielding was 19 but his arm and range were pretty low.

#31259	02/26/2016 4:43:31 pm
admin Joined: 01/27/2010 Posts: 5045 Administrator	Error aren't really counted as fielding versus throwing errors. They could be either. For a LH 2B the penalty should also eliminate him from completing double plays. It probably doesn't. You're right, the penalty does not eliminate him from making double player, but that doesn't mean it's not effected. Steve

#31261	02/26/2016 5:02:20 pm
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9846 Haverhill Halflings II.1	For a LH 2B the penalty should also eliminate him from completing double plays. It probably doesn't. Not sure why it would have any effect on DPs at all. A shovel pass from a lefty is the same as a shovel pass from a righty.

#31263	02/26/2016 5:17:55 pm
MukilteoMike Joined: 08/09/2014 Posts: 3294 Inactive	??? Second basemen have to make the throw to first for DPs, too. My guess is they make more throws than shortstops since there are more right-handed batters and players pull more than push. I don't understand your point.

#31264	02/26/2016 5:41:45 pm
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9846 Haverhill Halflings II.1	NM, I misunderstood and thought you were questioning my point. On a second read-through I see you were obviously questioning afreespirit's point. Updated Friday, February 26 2016 @ 8:17:56 pm PST

#31265	02/26/2016 5:52:13 pm
DaveCool Joined: 02/28/2015 Posts: 141 Inactive	A shovel pass is one thing, but actually turning the pivot and throwing from 2B to 1B would be slow and awkward since the 2B would have to rotate his body to make the throw to 1B.

#31267	02/26/2016 5:56:37 pm
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9846 Haverhill Halflings II.1	Its a pivot on the right foot instead of a pivot on the left foot. More difficult? Maybe. Impossible? Not at all.

#31270	02/26/2016 6:56:21 pm
afreespirit Joined: 09/17/2011 Posts: 305 Inactive	That may be true for the X-Box experience, but not in real life. Throwing mechanics 101, rule 1; glove side towards target. For 2B on a DP you reach the bag facing toward the plate area with some momentum going that way. It's simple for a RH to throw to 1B because his glove side is already towards the target at 1B, and the momentum helps put some additional velocity on the throw. A LH has the glove side towards 3B. To complete the DP he has to change his facing 180 deg. A complete reversal of position with momentum still towards the plate area (he is now backing up!) while simultaneously avoiding tripping over the bag (It's 3-5" thick not flush with the ground, it's an obstacle) and avoiding the base runner sliding hard into 2B to break up the play. Attempting this in real life is going to result in injury far more than a successful completion of the DP. You also cannot make an underhand shovel pass the 90' from 2B to 1B in time. That's just another silly claim.

#31271	02/26/2016 7:04:24 pm
afreespirit Joined: 09/17/2011 Posts: 305 Inactive	An additional problem for a LH is tagging a sliding basetealer. The glove of the LH is on the wrong side of the bag and on a good throw from the catcher he has to backhand it which is a bit more difficult than for a RH. Advantage runner.

#31272	02/26/2016 7:41:13 pm
Spoonerific Joined: 01/17/2013 Posts: 339 Inactive	You also cannot make an underhand shovel pass the 90' from 2B to 1B in time. That's just another silly claim. What if it was Pablo Sandoval who hit the grounder though?

#31273	02/26/2016 7:45:54 pm
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9846 Haverhill Halflings II.1	@afreespirit Every time you respond to this topic you convince me more and more that you have never even seen this game played. For 2B on a DP you reach the bag facing toward the plate area I think you are confusing 2B with CF. You are facing towards LF when you take a ball at 2B. Tip - You don't actually stand on 2B when you play 2B. Its played differently then 1B and 3B. You also cannot make an underhand shovel pass the 90' from 2B to 1B in time. That's just another silly claim. LOL, I was referring to the shovel pass from 2B to SS when you are going to the right. But now that you mentioned it, moving to the left, the left hander actually has an easier shovel pass to 1B. Its basically identical to a righty shovel passing to second. And if you don't think 2B ever shovel pass the ball its clear that you have never either played nor watched the game played. Tip #2 - The runner going to second usually actually gets there faster than the batter going to 1B. This is because of a concept called the "lead", and the fact that the batter has to finish his swing and dispose of the bat before can really start running at full speed. Tip #3 - There is a variation of the thing were refer in baseball to as the "double play" in which the 2B throws the ball to the 1B who then throws the ball to the SS standing on second base. Did you think a 2B would try to shovel pass the ball to 1B while standing on second? LOL! LH 2B the penalty should also eliminate him from completing double plays And back to the actual statement you are trying to deflect from. How does any of what you said support your supposition that lefties are entirely incapable of ever turning a DP? Updated Friday, February 26 2016 @ 8:21:40 pm PST

#31278	02/26/2016 9:46:07 pm
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9846 Haverhill Halflings II.1	Left handed shovel pass for DB And another Both of these would have been easier if they weren't wearing gloves on their left hand, or munching on dirt. Or actually lefties for that matter. Somehow a righty can make a left handed shovel pass to the SS while diving and wearing a glove, yet it would simply be impossible for a lefty to do such a throw. This one is truly amazing. An elusive 6-4-3. Given a righty SS throwing to second is identical to a lefty 2B throwing to second (glove on outside, facing opposite field), it must be rare, right? Right? LOL! BTW, afreespirit, these video links depict that game that we refer to as "baseball." Tip #4, there are no wickets in baseball. If you think about it. Using afreespirit's Throwing 101 rule, a left handed short stop should really have a bonus for turning a 4-6-3 because he is better positioned for the throw and doesn't have the reset the way a righty does. So Steve should probably add a fielding bonus for lefty SS. Updated Friday, February 26 2016 @ 10:17:44 pm PST

#31346	02/29/2016 10:32:27 am
Crazy Li Joined: 01/25/2015 Posts: 879 Inactive	Ignoring the tangent of how things work in real life, let's get to the most important issue... Error aren't really counted as fielding versus throwing errors. They could be either. They're not counted individually, no. I understand that the system doesn't make a distinction between throwing or fielding errors nor tracks them separately... but the big question here is: are both fielding AND arm checked when determining an error?

#31363	02/29/2016 5:25:13 pm
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9846 Haverhill Halflings II.1	I've always worked under the assumption that they are both checked, but I don't know for sure.